The West Block – Episode 12, SEason 13 – National | 24CA News

THE WEST BLOCK
Episode 12, Season 13
Sunday, December 3, 2023

Host: Mercedes Stephenson

Guests:
Bill Blair, Defence Minister
Paul Kershaw, Generation Squeeze Founder
Laura Tamblyn Watts, CanAge CEO

Location:
Ottawa, ON

Mercedes Stephenson: A stark warning from Canada’s prime army brass that the Canadian Armed Forces should not able to function in an more and more harmful world. Will the warnings from these admirals and generals change the federal government’s course on defence spending?

I’m Mercedes Stephenson. The West Block begins now.

Ottawa proclaims a $10 billion deal to exchange its growing old Aurora surveillance plane. It’s a bit of fine news at a time when the army is stretched to the restrict of personnel and gear. I converse to Defence Minister Bill Blair in regards to the push to show issues round.

Plus, is retirement a pipedream for the subsequent technology? How lengthy will it’s a must to work earlier than you’ll be able to take pleasure in your golden years?

The federal authorities made it official final week. It’s changing its growing old Aurora patrol fleet with Boeing’s P8A Poseidon plane. The Aurora’s have performed a important function in Canadian intelligence gathering. For instance, they had been used to establish ISIS targets in Iraq, and so they’re the identical plane that the Chinese army has been aggressively intercepting over the Pacific. The deal for the brand new planes will value simply over $10 billion, with the primary of the 14 plane anticipated to reach in 2026. The announcement comes because the army continues to juggle a number of challenges, from growing old gear to main recruitment shortfalls. That message hit house this week in a viral YouTube video that was made by the highest commander of the Royal Canadian Navy.

Vice-Admiral Angus Topshee, Royal Canadian Navy Commander: “The RCM faces some very serious challenges right now that could mean we fail to meet our force posture and readiness commitments in 2024 and beyond. The RCM is in a critical state, with many occupations experiencing shortages at 20 per cent and higher.”

Mercedes Stephenson: To discuss in regards to the challenges and options, hopefully, going through the Canadian army, I’m joined by Defence Minister Bill Blair.

Welcome to this system, Minister Blair.

Bill Blair, Defence Minister: Thank you very a lot. Good morning, Mercedes.

Mercedes Stephenson: That was a fairly hanging video by Admiral Topshee. It’s not usually that we hear senior generals or senior admirals come out and be that stark of their evaluation, that they might not be capable to defend the nation. They could not be capable to meet their targets. What did you make of Admiral Topshee’s video and do you agree along with his evaluation?

Bill Blair, Defence Minister Well, to begin with, I work very carefully with Admiral Topshee and with General Eyre, our chief of defence workers, General Kenny accountable for our air drive and General Paul accountable for the military. And—and I believe it’s necessary that we, we now have amongst one another, with one another, but in addition with Canadians, candid, stark and—and frank conversations about what’s required to ensure that them to—to finish the mission of preserving Canada protected and likewise to dwelling as much as our very vital worldwide commitments to NATO, to NORAD and within the Indo-Pacific. Now we ask quite a lot of the Canadian Armed Forces, and I believe for a quantity—and I don’t wish to form of [00:03:11] the previous, however I believe for a really very long time, we didn’t make the required investments within the platforms, to begin with that our army works on, the service combatant ships that Admiral Topshee refers to, the P8, our multi-mission plane that the air drive was in a position to purchase yesterday and a few of the primary gear of tanks and artillery and ammunition that the military wants. All of these items require vital new investments.

Mercedes Stephenson: Minister, you acknowledge that we’re dwelling in a extra harmful world. We are watching aggression from China. We are watching the struggle within the Middle East. We are watching Russia’s struggle in Ukraine. And sure, you’re changing some platforms, however they’re all platforms that had been flagged as in want of substitute a minimum of eight years in the past when your authorities took over. At the identical time, we’re going through dire shortages. I’ve spoken to a variety of senior commanders and in reality, General Wayne Eyre mentioned this at committee: if there was a struggle, we solely have three days’ price of ammunition. We’re required to have 30 by NATO. We don’t have wherever close to that. We’re 27 days brief. Why has your authorities allowed the important shortfall of ammunition and different supplies which are required to defend Canada?

Bill Blair, Defence Minister: Well let me be actually clear. One of the roles the prime minister has given me is to attempt to untie a few of the knots of army procurement to really with the [00:04:30 ISED] minister and with our procurement minister to create, you already know, a greater provide chain of ammunition and ensure that we are able to truly have an effect on these acquisitions in a well timed method. We’ve additionally been challenged, and I believe General Eyre would acknowledge this as a result of we’ve additionally made pretty vital commitments—not simply us, however all of our NATO companions and allies—in supporting Ukraine and its struggle towards Russia, and that’s taken a few of that offer off. But—however I don’t disagree with you in any respect, and it’s one thing that frankly, once I took over this place, I sat down with the chief of defence and the deputy minister of—minister of nationwide defence and we’ve been engaged on what have been their challenges in buying the ammunition and a few of it’s useful resource, however an terrible lot of it’s simply course of. And so making that course of work extra successfully and get…

Mercedes Stephenson: Well and I, you already know, Minister…

Bill Blair, Defence Minister: And securing these provide chains is a important a part of what we now have to do.

Mercedes Stephenson: I hear you on Ukraine and the fabric that’s been given out and ammunition, however different nations have purchased this. In truth, different nations are spending far more than Canada has. They’re rising their defence spending. Canada is making cuts to the defence finances, which I do know your authorities says aren’t cuts. But the definition of cuts is often if you take cash out and also you don’t put it again in, which is successfully what is occurring. Why in mild of acknowledging the scarcity of personnel within the harmful world that we reside in are you not spending extra?

Bill Blair, Defence Minister: Well and—and let me simply form of articulate that as a result of I don’t suppose you’ve fairly captured precisely what we’re doing with defence spending. In 2017, we introduced ahead a plan, Strong, Secure and Engaged, to extend defence spending by 70 per cent over an eight yr interval. We’re six years into that and we’re proper on monitor. Defence spending is definitely gone up.

Mercedes Stephenson: But you’re at 1.23 per cent, which is properly under the two per cent NATO goal.

Bill Blair, Defence Minister: And—however we’re shifting ahead. The—the purpose I wish to make is we’re placing considerably new sources in. But we additionally acknowledge as a result of the world was altering and significantly after the invasion off Ukraine, the more and more aggressive posture taken on by each Russia and China, and a few of the obligations within the Indo-Pacific and in our personal Arctic and naturally, in NATO. We acknowledge that we now have to proceed to take a position much more. More than we mentioned in Strong, Secure and Engaged in 2017, and that’s why we now have introduced ahead a plan that’s very a lot in dialogue proper now, inside our authorities, about making vital new investments. I hope I’ve made it very clear, publicly, that we acknowledge we should do extra. We’re going to do extra, however there’s additionally some context within the doing that extra as a result of there’s a fiscal scenario in Canada that I’ve to be real looking about what could be achieved. We’re spending taxpayers’ {dollars}, Mercedes, and I’ve at all times tried to be very cautious once we try this. So one of many issues I used to be requested to do by Treasury Board is to check out how we administer a few of our processes in our monetary administration, in our human sources administration, in consulting companies {and professional} companies and government journey, and a broad vary of issues that over time bureaucracies are inclined to turn into bureaucratic and I believe there’s at all times a necessity for individuals like myself to go and ensure that we’re being as environment friendly as doable in delivering the defence capabilities that CAF wants and the nation wants.

Mercedes Stephenson: So then why not take that cash and put it again into the operations and upkeep finances?

Bill Blair, Defence Minister: Well to begin with, we—we now have a major finances for upkeep and for operations…

Mercedes Stephenson: But it’s a shortfall from what we’d like based on all these senior generals and admirals who’re saying that they don’t have what they should do what’s required.

Bill Blair, Defence Minister: Well let’s—when you don’t—however let’s not combine up apples and oranges. There—there’s a reasonably vital expenditure of administrate—in administration and my job is to ensure that we try this as effectively and as affordably as doable. And on the similar time, there’s a really significant slice of that finances which is devoted to that upkeep and that offer. Last yr, the Canadian Armed Forces was unable to spend over $2 billion of the finances and it’s as a result of their processes of procurement should not as environment friendly as they have to be. And so it’s not a matter of us not giving them sufficient sources. It’s a matter of—of creating certain that these processes work for them in order that they’re in a position to do this upkeep, they’re in a position to purchase that ammunition, they’re in a position to make the investments that they should make. And then largely importantly, is fixing this deficit of individuals as a result of the actual energy of the Canadian Armed Forces is the women and men who serve that.

Mercedes Stephenson: Speaking of investments in platforms and applied sciences. In February of this yr, I spoke to Minister Anand when she was the defence minister, and we had been speaking in regards to the tanks that Canada despatched to Ukraine. She informed me it was prime of her precedence checklist mainly to get to work on changing these tanks, and as you already know, there’s a really massive variety of Canadian tanks in Latvia proper now as properly. What’s the standing of the substitute mission for the tanks? I haven’t seen something come out about it. I haven’t seen it go to tender. Has your authorities began the method of changing them?

Bill Blair, Defence Minister: We’re properly on our method. Of course, we’ve recognized, you already know, all of our necessities with respect to these tanks. We know what we wish, the Leopard tank, and we’ve acquired—we’re additionally making investments in sustaining those we’ve acquired, however we do know we’d like extra. The procurement course of is, as I’ve already talked about to you, Mercedes, to begin with, I don’t discuss an excessive amount of about the place we’re at and significantly processes as a result of I wish to ensure that I don’t do something that interferes with these contracts, however on the similar time, what I’m discovering is, and I believe you’re conscious of this and most Canadians are, a few of these procurement contracts take an extremely very long time to execute. And the time between when the Canadian Armed Forces defines the necessity and once we’ll truly be capable to get them within the door, it takes a while—an inordinate period of time and an unacceptable period of time, so it’s—we’re attempting to not solely to handle the associated fee, however to additionally handle the time that it takes to ship them. That once more, is one among my tasks. I’m working with a few of the greatest individuals I do know in authorities and within the Canadian Armed Forces to, as you say, untie a few of these knots. I used to be more than happy, yesterday, we had been in a position to—we heard very clearly from the Royal Canadian Air Force about what it wanted in a multi-mission plane to exchange the CP-140, the Auroras. The recognized their necessities and we decided that the one airplane that presently was obtainable and that met all of these necessities was the P8, and though it was a procurement not with out its challenges, I used to be very, more than happy to have the ability to announce to the Canadian Armed Forces and to the Royal Canadian Air Force that we had been in a position to purchase these planes for them and that they had been going to be getting them throughout the subsequent two years, earlier than the CP-140s age out of service. And in order that’s our duty is to get jobs like that carried out, and I used to be more than happy that yesterday we had been in a position—I hope we had been in a position to ship a sign about our dedication to ship for the Canadian Armed Forces. We’re going to proceed to ship for them as a result of they ship for us.

Mercedes Stephenson: Thank you very a lot for becoming a member of us right now, minister. And good luck with I’m certain what’s a troublesome job forward of you.

Bill Blair, Defence Minister: No, it’s the most effective job in authorities. Thanks very a lot, Mercedes.

Mercedes Stephenson: Up subsequent, is freedom 55 now a pipedream? We dig into a brand new report that reveals many Canadians aren’t prepared for retirement.

[Break]

Mercedes Stephenson: With numbers out final week that the economic system is slowing and unemployment is up, fascinated by retirement appears like a pipedream for lots of us proper now, and that’s backed up by a brand new report that discovered nearly all of individuals close to retirement age should not financially prepared to depart the workforce. Only 14 per cent are retirement prepared. 31 per cent might want to depend on public revenue like CPP and Old Age Security. About 55 per cent should make life-style cuts to keep away from outliving their very own financial savings, and a staggering 73 per cent will face monetary hardship in the event that they require long run care.

And for younger Canadians who’re struggling to afford a house and discover jobs, is retirement even a chance? To discuss all of this, I’m joined by Paul Kershaw, the founding father of Generation Squeeze and a professor at UBC School of Population and Public Health, and Laura Tamblyn Watts, the CEO of CanAge, a nationwide seniors’ advocacy group.

Good morning to each of you. Not the cheeriest of matters, however an necessary one. You know, we had been speaking about this across the workplace and simply saying whether or not you’re on the finish of your profession and fascinated by retiring, or not too long ago retired and questioning when you can afford to remain there, or for a few of the youthful individuals who work in our bureau, questioning in the event that they’re ever going to have the ability to retire. It’s not a very rosy and optimistic outlook.

Paul, are you able to begin us off with giving us a way of the place that is going and the way apprehensive we needs to be?

Paul Kershaw, Generation Squeeze Founder: Well I believe that there are two issues that we’d like to concentrate on. On the one hand, for a youthful demographic, I do more and more fear in regards to the pressures that they’ll face in a while of their aspirations to retire as a result of the truth is that for younger of us right now, arduous work doesn’t repay prefer it used to. They will go to post-secondary extra and pay extra for the privilege to land jobs that truly usually are paying much less after adjusting for inflation. And then everyone knows they’re going through dramatically greater housing costs that more and more lock them out of possession and their comfort prize is awful, rising rents. And all of which means it’s a lot tougher to avoid wasting for retirement down the highway. And on prime of that, and we now have to consider right now’s growing old inhabitants, these are our members of the family. It’s my mother, my in-laws, and so forth., and for that demographic, the info are considerably constructive that they’ve a few of the lowest charges of poverty within the nation, essentially the most wealth of fine quantity of housing safety, however many years in the past, our authorities form of allow them to and allow us to down as a result of we didn’t work out the right way to pay successfully for a wholesome retirement for an growing old demographic pushed by the child increase.

And if I may simply add another commentary to your listeners, you already know, again within the day when child boomers had been younger adults, there have been seven working age residents to pay for each retiree. Now boomers have each purpose to anticipate I would like the identical if not higher advantages, however they’re simply three working age residents to pay for each retiree, and that’s including some dangers to what can we do to guard the safety for our retired family members, however it’s additionally placing numerous stress on youthful taxpayers.

Mercedes Stephenson: Laura, what occurs if you—you’ve labored arduous your entire like, you’ve saved appropriately for what you had been anticipating, however now issues are dearer, individuals are dwelling longer, particularly girls usually outlive and make much less whereas they’re working than males. What is the state of affairs proper now for senior Canadians?

Laura Tamblyn Watts, CanAge CEO: Well it’s not as rosy as we would need. You know, I do know that the way in which that we calculate how individuals are doing when it comes to poverty index and so forth is there, and with these numbers older adults on the entire appear like they’re doing fairly properly, however the actuality of the circumstance is we measure the flawed stuff. And what which means is the measurements are based mostly on a household of 4 in form of their center years, and the basket of products and companies that we rely should not often the basket of products and companies that seniors want. So care, the price of care house care, care provision, all of that isn’t within the basket of products. When we’re fascinated by what we’d like as older individuals, together with drugs and so forth that aren’t lined, these are additionally not within the basket of products. And what it means as properly is that not solely we’re counting the flawed stuff that they’re changing into far more costly at a time when debt was low cost, so many older individuals are very a lot in debt. Boomers are essentially the most indebted technology we’ve ever had. Some of them are retiring with pupil debt, let alongside mortgage debt. So they’ve accrued numerous debt, however their cash didn’t make a lot as a result of rates of interest had been traditionally low. Now, the price of debt has gone up and their value of dwelling has gone up and infrequently they’re not with the ability to make as a lot cash within the door, so it’s truly a really poor scenario.

Mercedes Stephenson: Paul, what occurs for the youthful technology, and I see this with so much my associates, delay having kids, you already know, you’re establishing your profession. It’s costly, you’re ready till later, and now you’re in a state of affairs the place you’re each caring for probably younger kids or having to pay for youngster care and on the similar time, worrying about growing old mother and father who may additionally require care or long run. It looks as if an amazing monetary burden and the place does the cash come from simply to get by everyday if you’re coping with these competing fam—not competing, you already know what I imply, however members of the family at reverse ends of their life spectrum that each require numerous care and some huge cash?

Paul Kershaw, Generation Squeeze Founder: Well it’s the proper query, and I really like a lot the way you corrected prefer it’s competing. It’s truly what we now have, I believe, is numerous love, and there’s numerous solidarity between older and youthful members of the family and the right way to work it out in order that not solely will we make our households work for all generations, however we have to make our nation and our authorities budgets work for all generations. And I’m—I’m onboard with Laura saying we frequently aren’t proper now measuring the proper issues. And I’m sympathetic to the truth that many individuals proper now may be having extra debt in retirement, however we have to—must put that in context. That debt will usually be within the context of 1’s housing and—properly there was slightly little bit of a trickle up within the variety of boomers who’re retiring with mortgage debt. Typically, that’s as a result of they’ve been refinancing properties and buying extra properties as a result of they’re making quite a lot of wealth coming from the housing system. And so I believe Laura is true. When we measure how individuals are doing, we have to transfer past revenue and suppose more and more about wealth since you could be a widow with a low revenue of say, round $25 thousand a yr and that shall be akin to love simply above the poverty line and simply above getting the Guaranteed Income Supplement on this nation, and we’d suppose that that particular person is actually financially struggling. And in the event that they’re a renter, they completely are. But in the event that they’re a house proprietor in Halifax or Hamilton or Victoria or Vancouver or Toronto, the may be individuals whose properties that they personal outright are price one million, if not many tens of millions extra. And in order that’s basically totally different than say, you may suppose a younger lawyer making $250 thousand, they’re the highest earners within the nation, however in some situations, they’ll barely afford to lease a two-bedroom place. And so we have to an increasing number of be fascinated by how will we measure affluence on this nation. How will we measure our potential to contribute to the companies we’d like in retirement and the companies we’d like like youngster care, like post-secondary, like reasonably priced housing? We have to essentially involves phrases with how—what we wish, how we’re going to pay for what we wish and be sure that we’re not leaving massive unpaid authorities payments by way of deficits for our youngsters and grandchildren.

Mercedes Stephenson: Laura, what is occurring for people who find themselves retiring now? I’ve heard some individuals considering that they might have to return again to work as a result of the quantity they saved that they thought could be sufficient now isn’t sufficient. Are you seeing numerous that, or is that extra a concern than one thing that’s truly manifesting?

Laura Tamblyn Watts, CanAge CEO: Oh no, we’re utterly altering it. And truly that’s okay to vary it, so long as we’re speaking about people who find themselves economically safe and more and more we’re not. What it means is that folks not solely live longer, in addition they must work longer. They—the concept of retirement at 65 got here out of a time the place individuals died at 67. That’s truly once we created our CPP, it was solely anticipated that you’d reside two years and then you definitely would die. Now we’re taking a look at a 3rd of our life. It received’t be shocking for anybody to say that folks want more cash and so they want extra safety. And there are some limitations that we have to callout. One of the largest limitations for individuals who wish to keep within the workforce longer, regardless that we’re within the greatest labour crunch we’ve ever had in Canada, you already know, ageism is enjoying an enormous function. And so of us are having a tough time getting again into the working world, the paid working world, after which we even have these extra layers of complexity round issues like the actual fact is most caregivers for older individuals are different older individuals, it’s not truly the generations under and they also’re attempting to determine how they’ll stability offering free look after spouses, associates, and even, you already know, mother and father of their 90s, whereas on the similar time, they don’t have the accrued wealth that they should.

The final piece I simply needed to share is there’s a structural drawback round housing, too. Quite proper, sure, many individuals have accrued wealth or fairness of their home, however we don’t even have locations for them to go to which are age-friendly and accessible and so most rental locations should not acceptable for older individuals. They’re not simply in a position to downsize and keep of their communities. Many of them—they’re going to promote or they’re going to have to maneuver far outdoors of the world that they’re into one thing far more distant, more difficult to get the companies and well being care that they want, the place transportation turns into an enormous concern. So once more, it’s not nearly the price of housing, it’s about the price of together with individuals in communities and we’re failing in that.

Mercedes Stephenson: Well actually huge questions forward about what that appears like and I’m certain whether or not or not these in my technology and youthful will ever be capable to retire. Paul and Laura, thanks each very a lot for becoming a member of us. I’m certain we’ll be speaking about this once more quickly as a result of it is a matter that fairly actually impacts everybody.

Paul Kershaw, Generation Squeeze Founder: Thank you.

Mercedes Stephenson: Up subsequent, severe misconduct allegations levelled towards Canada’s spy company.

[Break]

Mercedes Stephenson: Now for one very last thing…

Last week, yet one more highly effective nationwide safety group confronted severe allegations of sexual misconduct and a poisonous office tradition. Whistleblowers from Canada’s spy company, CSIS, informed the Canadian Press that the British Columbia workplace of CSIS was a “dark and disturbing place.” The allegations included harassment and rape. It’s not the primary time we’ve heard considerations about CSIS. During the worldwide pandemic, Global News reported on allegations of poisonous office tradition, racism and harassment by senior managers, in addition to a demoralized workers.

Those who work in nationwide safety are very important to this nation and so they make numerous sacrifices, but rooting out sexual misconduct and guaranteeing oversight of highly effective and shadowy organizations appears to be an ongoing problem.

Those who defend the nation deserve higher, and right here at The West Block, we now have extra reporting to return in coming weeks on this topic to carry these organizations accountable.

That’s our present for right now. We’ll see you subsequent Sunday.