The West Block – Episode 13, Season 13 – National | 24CA News

THE WEST BLOCK
Episode 13, Season 13
Sunday, December 10, 2023

Host: Mercedes Stephenson

Guests:
Jonathan Wilkinson, Energy and Natural Resources Minister
Kate Armstrong, First Female Cadet at RMC
Lt.-Col. (Ret’d) Mark Popov, Former Director of Cadets at RMC

Location:
Ottawa, ON

Mercedes Stephenson: The battle over the carbon tax boiled over within the House of Commons, the local weather coverage entrance and centre for each the Liberals and Conservatives.

I’m Mercedes Stephenson, and The West Block begins now.

The Liberals unveiled long-awaited emissions targets for the oil and gasoline trade. Alberta Premier Danielle Smith vows to battle them.

Danielle Smith, Alberta Premier: “This isn’t going to work. Alberta’s not going to accept. In fact, we’re going to fight it every step of the way.”

Mercedes Stephenson: The vitality and pure assets minister weighs in on the critics…

Pierre Poilievre, Opposition Leader: “We’re going to axe the tax.”

Mercedes Stephenson: And the Conservatives.

And a better take a look at the place the place navy leaders are shaped. Is Canada making the correct adjustments to provide moral and powerful navy leaders?

As the summit referred to as COP28 involves a detailed this week, the battle over the carbon tax heated up right here at dwelling within the House of Commons.

The federal Liberals have been beneath hearth for his or her signature local weather insurance policies, from each the correct and from environmentalists.

Last week, the Trudeau authorities introduced new targets to cut back emissions from the oil and gasoline trade. There’s a plan to chop methane by at the least 75 per cent, and oil and gasoline emissions by 35 to 38 per cent by 2030.

I spoke to Energy and Natural Resources Minister Jonathan Wilkinson on Friday, after he had been up for an evening of continuous voting within the House of Commons, triggered by the Conservatives opposition to the carbon tax.

Joining me now could be Energy and Natural Resources Minister Jonathan Wilkinson. Minister, welcome to this system. I do know you should be drained after a really late night time of being up voting.

Jonathan Wilkinson, Energy and Natural Resources Minister: It’s been a really tiring 24 hours, however I’m completely satisfied to be right here.

Mercedes Stephenson: Now this—this 24 hours, these parliamentary shenanigans, if you’ll, by the Conservatives, all that are allowed beneath the foundations which have dragged MP voting across the clock and led to them threatening to not let MPs go dwelling earlier than Christmas are largely associated to the carbon tax. Would you contemplate seeding to any of their calls for or advised amendments to seek out some bipartisan settlement earlier than Christmas?

Jonathan Wilkinson, Energy and Natural Resources Minister: No. I imply, what’s happening within the House proper now could be an abuse of parliamentary course of. It could also be technically allowed beneath the legislation, or beneath the foundations, however I might inform you that there is no such thing as a different office in Canada that might truly permit folks to be handled the way in which that members of Parliament are being handled. As you already know, we’ve been voting now for 19 hours. We’re in all probability voting for an additional 10 or 11 hours going ahead with no breaks, each 10 minutes a vote. At the tip of the day, the position of the official opposition is unquestionably to oppose in a constructive approach and to attempt to make strategies about issues that needs to be modified, however they aren’t the federal government of Canada. They don’t dictate coverage. And on the finish of the day, the Opposition is taking part in a sport right here that’s only a ridiculous sport.

Mercedes Stephenson: You know, the Opposition is actually taking part in parliamentary video games with this, however polls counsel that Canadians are pissed off along with your authorities, and plenty of are pissed off with the carbon tax. They’re pissed off with the truth that a part of the nation obtained a break and different elements of the nation didn’t get a break. Do you suppose that possibly now could be a time to take a re-examination about whether or not there may be room for compromise, even when it’s not with the Conservatives, in your strategy to the carbon tax and the way you’re coping with among the huge environmental points except for main polluters, if you’re speaking about insurance policies that have an effect on particular person Canadians?

Jonathan Wilkinson, Energy and Natural Resources Minister: Well I believe, Mercedes, we have now to make sure that once we’re setting up insurance policies, they need to be executed in a way that’s inexpensive for Canadians. No query about that. I might say that one of many issues that you just mentioned there that was that the warmth—the oil and warmth pump program for Atlantic Canadians. It’s truly for Canadians throughout the nation who truly use heating oil and there may be very particular causes. The prices of heating oil are considerably larger than any type of heating and have escalated way more quickly. But I might say, sure, we have now to be working to make sure that local weather initiatives are inexpensive. We even have executed that within the design of the worth on air pollution, the place 8 out of 10 Canadians get extra money again. And there was a examine launched by the University of Calgary simply this week that really confirmed that it’s individuals who reside on modest and center incomes get considerably extra money again and that by taking away the rebate, you’re truly solely serving to individuals who have some huge cash. So, we have to talk that higher, however the design of the worth on air pollution was completely targeted on affordability issues.

Mercedes Stephenson: But doesn’t that form of contradict what you simply mentioned about it affecting individuals who in lots of circumstances are in conditions of vitality poverty in Atlantic Canada that they—clearly, I assume—it could’t be working financially for them if you happen to made the choice to offer them a break?

Jonathan Wilkinson, Energy and Natural Resources Minister: But that’s precisely why we made the choice with respect to heating oil is the disparity when it comes to the worth and the quantity that individuals pay for that exact type of heating is so excessive that they weren’t getting extra money again, that group of individuals, which is a comparatively small group of individuals throughout the nation. But on common, 8 out of 10 Canadian households get extra money again. Certainly people who use pure gasoline heating get extra money again. If you had been to take away the worth on air pollution, as Mr. Poilievre desires to do, you’d even be eradicating the rebates, and the folks you’d be hurting are individuals who reside on reasonable incomes.

Mercedes Stephenson: Do you suppose that Canadians will agree with you if you happen to take this to an election?

Jonathan Wilkinson, Energy and Natural Resources Minister: Well, I believe we’re going to take a broader dialog to Canadians in an election that merely the worth on air pollution. We have a really complete strategy to addressing the local weather difficulty, which includes, you already know, the cap that we put in place on oil and gasoline emissions, yesterday. It includes investments just like the Dow chemical facility, the $11.5 billion funding in a internet zero facility that we introduced a pair weeks in the past. I imply, it’s a broad strategy, however it’s an strategy that acknowledges that you must deal with this environmental disaster, however you must do it in a approach that really goes to make sure a robust financial system going ahead. And you can’t have a related plan for the way forward for the Canadian financial system in a world world that’s transferring to handle carbon emissions, if you happen to don’t settle for the fact of local weather change. And Mr. Poilievre doesn’t settle for the fact of local weather change, or he simply doesn’t cares.

Mercedes Stephenson: Obviously, you must cope with local weather change and that actuality, and also you additionally on the finish of the day are a politician, you must get elected. Sometimes these may be robust issues to stability. You launched your info on basically cap and commerce for trade, huge producers of oil and gasoline, and the response from that from Alberta and Saskatchewan as among the trade has been that it isn’t truly a cap on emissions, which was promised, that it’s a cap on manufacturing and that it’s going to have an effect on their potential to proceed to provide on the ranges that the federal government and Canada wants with the intention to stay aggressive. What’s your response to that criticism of what’s one among your huge signature insurance policies?

Jonathan Wilkinson, Energy and Natural Resources Minister: Well, I might say if you happen to take heed to the criticism, there have been actually some within the sector who suppose it goes too far. There had been actually some within the environmental group who don’t suppose it goes far sufficient. At the tip of the day, we labored very arduous to make sure that we had been designing this strategy, specializing in emissions that’s in—throughout the federal authorities’s ambit from a constitutional perspective. It was not targeted on addressing manufacturing as a result of that falls inside a provincial jurisdiction.

If you take a look at what we have now executed, we checked out what are the technically possible emissions reductions which you can obtain between now and 2030. The largest ones are methane-related discount, which is one thing that Premier Smith herself truly dedicated to engaged on earlier than the final Alberta election, and the work within the oil sands, which we have now developed with Pathways and the numbers which might be within the cap proposal are literally Pathways numbers.

Mercedes Stephenson: Are you involved—simply to be the everyday journalist right here, who on the one hand will ask you if this can be a manufacturing cap, and now will ask you the query out of your different critics, proper, as a result of our job is to place the entire inquiries to politicians. Environmental teams who say this isn’t what was promised, this isn’t going to get you anyplace close to what you should do to realize your 2030 targets, which you already are going to be missed, that you just’re introducing this fairly late in your mandate. You’ve been in energy since 2015, they usually’re involved concerning the authorities’s dedication on the setting. Why, if you’re so dedicated to local weather change, are you not taking a more durable stance on the large emitters who would have a far bigger affect than say, the common Canadian driving their automobile?

Jonathan Wilkinson, Energy and Natural Resources Minister: Well the very first thing I might say is definitely the file on local weather change may be very robust. When we got here to energy, the goal to realize was 30 per cent under 2005 ranges in 2030. We are approach past that now. We have an intermediate goal of 2026, which is 20 per cent under, and we’ll exceed that, and that was within the emissions discount replace that got here out yesterday. And proper now, we’re on observe to realize 36 per cent, and we have now a lot of further initiatives that can get us to the 40 per cent. So we’re on observe to realize what we have now dedicated to do to the worldwide group. Part of that’s the cap on oil and gasoline emissions. We want to make sure that we’re seeing important declines in absolute emissions within the oil and gasoline sector, it’s the biggest polluter within the nation. But it needs to be executed in a way that really is sensible. You can’t demand of the trade one thing that’s bodily unimaginable to do. And so what we checked out had been what are the technically possible or technically achievable reductions between now and 2030. How can we truly incent their—or require the sector to go even additional by means of the usage of issues like home offsets or investments in a decarbonisation fund that can carry further reductions submit 2030, and make sure that the sector is doing its half. But on the finish of the day, you already know, asking a sector, any sector, to do one thing that’s unimaginable simply shouldn’t be—not reasonable.

Mercedes Stephenson: How assured are you within the know-how, as a result of there’s been fairly a little bit of criticism that counting on carbon seize as a method to cope with that is merely not going to get us to what your personal self-imposed targets are?

Jonathan Wilkinson, Energy and Natural Resources Minister: Well, I might say to start with, the majority of the emissions reductions are literally within the methane space and there’s a lot of know-how in that house. And in actual fact, within the aftermath of placing the preliminary methane laws on, there have been about 170 firms primarily in Alberta that really began as much as service that market, which is nice from an financial improvement perspective. But when it comes to the Pathways work, carbon seize and sequestration is a crucial a part of that work. I’ll inform you, Mercedes, I spent nearly 20 years as an government and as a CEO within the cleantech house. I’m fairly accustomed to carbon seize know-how. It shouldn’t be—lots of the implementations aren’t new. They’re not notably novel. It’s about how do you scale that and the way do you scale back it in value so to truly make it financial? There’s big work that’s been executed. Increasingly, we have now moved the ball. There are giant firms now, worldwide firms that can provide CCUS programs with efficiency ensures. So, I’m not that apprehensive from a know-how perspective, however in fact, we have now to make sure that the general economics will work as we transfer to implement these applied sciences.

Mercedes Stephenson: I do know that you must get again in and vote, minister as a result of these rounds and rounds of votes are nonetheless going. Thank you for making time for us on a day once I know you’ve had no sleep.

Jonathan Wilkinson, Energy and Natural Resources Minister: Not in any respect. Thank you very a lot.

Mercedes Stephenson: Up subsequent, we check out the guts of the place Canada’s navy officer tradition is shaped.

Lt.-Col. Mark Popov, Former Director of Cadets at RMC: “[00:11:27] and don’t get caught.”

Mercedes Stephenson: Amid the calls for for reform, we take a look at the federal government’s determination to order a evaluation of navy faculties in the end.

[Break]

Mercedes Stephenson: Alarming new numbers present that the variety of troops who say they’ve skilled sexual assault has gone up.

In 2022, round 2,000, that’s about 3.5 per cent of standard power members surveyed say that they’ve been sexually assaulted within the office. That’s greater than double the speed from 2018.

The defence minister insists the federal government is conserving their promise to cope with the scourge of sexual misconduct.

Bill Blair, Defence Minister: “An increase in reporting is deeply concerning to us, but I think it can also be indicative of a perhaps greater confidence among victims, that if they do come forward and bring forward their complaint, that they will be taken seriously.”

Mercedes Stephenson: Sexual misconduct and sexual assault carried out by senior brass is extensively considered as probably the most poisonous risks to the Canadian Armed Forces. It’s one thing that the entire appointments and bulletins within the navy gained’t repair except there’s a change of tradition of these in cost. And that tradition is formed by navy faculties, like Royal Military College and College Saint-Jean, the 2 universities that almost all Canadian navy officers attend. It is there that numerous victims and specialists have alleged the issues with abuse of energy and impunity start. Will the evaluation that the federal government introduced final week carry long-awaited adjustments? And are issues bettering for these contained in the forces within the face of such regarding sexual assault statistics?

Joining me now could be Kate Armstrong, her memoir, The Stone Frigate, detailed her expertise as the primary feminine cadet at Royal Military College, and retired Lt.-Col. Mark Popov, the previous head of officer cadet coaching at RMC. We first spoke to retired Col. Popov a few years in the past now, Mark, about what was occurring at RMC and your expertise in attempting to type out sexual misconduct, and also you say shedding your profession for it. For those that aren’t acquainted, let’s begin with you Mark. What are the issues which have traditionally existed for RMC on the subject of sexual misconduct?

Lt.-Col. (Ret’d) Mark Popov, Former Director of Cadets at RMC: Well I believe the most important drawback with RMC when it comes down to essentially not simply sexual misconduct however elementary query: What is RMC for? You know, the prime minister of Canada, Canadians, the defence minister, chief of defence employees, must resolve is it going to be a level granting establishment, an educational college the place the scholars put on uniforms? Or is it going to be a coaching—an officer coaching establishment that gives junior officers to steer the little kids that serve within the Canadian Armed Forces in among the worst circumstances on this planet? Couple with that’s the problem of supervision and management. Typically at RMC, there’s not very many, comparatively talking, supervisors, commissioned officers and senior non-commissioned officers to information and supervise the officer cadets in everyday and night actions, and that exhibits. It’s a big uncontrolled inhabitants of younger folks, lots of them away from dwelling for his or her first time, they usually want somewhat bit extra steerage and path than the present staffing and group of RMC let occur.

Mercedes Stephenson: Kate, you had been the primary feminine cadet, and it’s at all times been fascinating to me that I used to be warned upfront once we began engaged on sexual misconduct that the navy will permit a whole lot of this. They’ll settle for it. But if you happen to go anyplace close to Royal Military College, that’s seen as untouchable. And you possibly can truly see it on-line with a lot of individuals who had supported the examinations in sexual misconduct and the looking on that, however once we began speaking about Royal Military College, there was a defensiveness that arose. Can you inform us somewhat bit about your sense of whether or not or not issues have modified considerably from if you had been first there?

Kate Armstrong, First Female Cadet at RMC: I’ve heard from tons of of people that have written to me and mentioned that’s my story, that’s my story. I’ve met cadets which were on the school from my time, during to current day cadets. I do know cadets which might be on the school now. And what I wrote about, a whole lot of the historic like conventional issues occurring that had been disturbing are nonetheless going, persevering with now.

Mercedes Stephenson: I do know, Mark, you witnessed some behaviour there that was deeply disturbing: feedback that had been made to underage women about sexual assault. When you tried to face as much as it, you say that your profession was basically ended due to that. Destroyed it. You weren’t presupposed to reprimand the cadets they mentioned. That was the issue versus the cadet behaviour. Why do you suppose RMC, specifically, has been so resistant to alter, if that allegation’s true?

Lt.-Col. (Ret’d) Mark Popov, Former Director of Cadets at RMC: If you take a look at how RMC works, you already know the commandant of RMC is a brigadier-general that usually hopes to be promoted some place else they usually know how to get promoted is to not make a mistake, not rock the boat, not have something dropped at consideration. That was purely the case for the 2 commandants that I had the misfortune of working for.

If you take a look at the West Point, now the superintendent of West Point is chosen by Congress, understanding that that will probably be his or her final posting. They will probably be there for, I consider, it’s a 4 to 5 12 months time period, and their job is to offer junior officers to the U.S. military. Full cease. That’s what they need to do. So that from a elementary how RMC suits within the group standpoint, it’s not setup for fulfillment when it comes to main change, tradition change, or addressing issues like I attempted to handle in a agency, forthright and direct method, to make the system higher.

Mercedes Stephenson: The authorities has introduced a evaluation into the Royal Military College and College Saint-Jean. It’s taken kind of two and a half years, I believe, since we first began reporting on this for that to come back out. What had been your ideas on Bill Blair’s announcement about this final week? Did that appear to be a substantive evaluation that’s warranted to you?

Lt.-Col. (Ret’d) Mark Popov, Former Director of Cadets at RMC: Well studying that, and I learn it a number of occasions intimately and I’ve learn the biographies of all of the board members, and I used to be not shocked, but amazed at how imprecise the announcement was. The board members, to me, appear to be the nice match. They’ve obtained an excellent mixture of expertise. They’ve obtained no—they’ve obtained pores and skin within the sport, however not RMC pores and skin within the sport. So I believe they—they actually have probability to be goal. I might be very to see, and so would different Canadians, what the mandate letter is. What are they looking for out? What deliverables have they got on the finish of this 12 months? So that’s one factor that’s actually missing on this announcement is what they’re attempting to see.

Mercedes Stephenson: One final half that is likely to be final, however it’s actually not least, I wished to the touch on was among the info from the Statistics Canada Survey that was launched final week about sexual assault, sexual misconduct throughout the forces. In it, it reported not solely larger numbers of sexual assault, which it was unimaginable for us to know if that’s a rise in reporting or a rise in incidents, however we all know actually the reported incidents are up. But amongst those that say they had been sexually assaulted, 64 per cent mentioned they didn’t report it. Pardon me, 64 per cent mentioned they didn’t report it, and 41 per cent mentioned the rationale why they didn’t report it’s as a result of they didn’t consider it will make a distinction. Kate, what does that say to you?

Kate Armstrong, First Female Cadet at RMC: It talks about security to me, and I consider that individuals which were assaulted want to listen to I consider you. I’m sorry that occurred to you. How can I make it easier to? And to really feel that that’s an trustworthy response to them coming ahead, and it additionally, like simply concerning the rise of the reporting, the security, I consider that due to you and due to the work that’s occurring publicly round what’s going on culturally. I consider that that’s the security, or the notion of security is rising and it permits folks to come back ahead. And that’s the important thing. Like the secret is to create an setting the place—like a tradition is only a shared [00:07:55 dreaming]. So all people must be on the identical web page, like Mark was saying about what’s the shared dream that we have now for RMC for the cadets?

Mercedes Stephenson: Mark, your ideas. Do you suppose that issues are bettering on the subject of sexual misconduct and getting outcomes when it’s reported contained in the forces and never punishing those that come ahead?

Lt.-Col. (Ret’d) Mark Popov, Former Director of Cadets at RMC: Yeah, I’ve to agree with Kate on this. When my story got here out, I used to be approached by a whole lot of former cadets, you already know, female and male, saying very a lot the identical issues. You know, we hate it. This is what occurred to me, and a whole lot of the thread that ran by means of was I didn’t suppose the chain of command would take me critically. I didn’t suppose something could be executed, and I used to be scared that if I advised my boss I might lose out on the right track promotion alternative. So I believe what we’re seeing now could be, I personally don’t suppose there’s extra assaults and misconduct, however I believe there’s extra reporting. I’m hopeful, and I actually do suppose that the folks that be a part of the Canadian Armed Forces actually, for probably the most half, need to the most effective and respect one another. The present, you already know, lapses within the justice system have executed victims and accused no good. We’ve seen excessive profile circumstances which were dropped out, quashed due to incapable administration on the a part of the Canadian Armed Forces, notably the navy police, in pursuing these. So there’s double edges right here. We’re getting extra reporting, I believe. The system has to do higher with addressing the reporting if the sufferer desires one thing to go forward with it. But I don’t see these—this spike in reporting as a large enhance in rape tradition within the forces. I truly suppose it’s that persons are reporting as a result of they’re having extra confidence within the system doing what’s good for them.

Mercedes Stephenson: Well we actually hope so Mark, and—sorry, go forward, Kate.

Kate Armstrong, First Female Cadet at RMC: I used to be simply going so as to add that one thing else that comes up very often is folks which might be successfully punished for having MST, like navy sexual trauma, they usually find yourself shedding their careers, but the perpetrators proceed on and generally rise to nice heights throughout the navy. And that doesn’t embolden folks to come back ahead and put themselves vulnerable to that.

Mercedes Stephenson: Yeah, and which may be a part of that 41 per cent who say that they’re involved that coming ahead wouldn’t make a distinction, one thing we’ll proceed to report on and look into. Thank you each a lot for becoming a member of us at the moment.

Kate Armstrong, First Female Cadet at RMC: Thank you.

Lt.-Col. (Ret’d) Mark Popov, Former Director of Cadets at RMC: Thanks very a lot.

Mercedes Stephenson: Up subsequent, the fear risk lurking in Canada.

[Break]

Mercedes Stephenson: Now for one very last thing…

While it’s the season of celebration for a lot of, a sinister power of hate is brewing right here in Canada, infecting younger minds on-line, radicalizing folks towards their fellow Canadians.

A neo-Nazi group referred to as Atomwaffen is working right here in Canada. They’re refined and harmful, in response to a number of nationwide safety sources.

Last week, two males had been arrested for his or her affiliation with the group. One is a widely known determine within the neo-Nazi world and charged with terror offences which might be nothing wanting blood chilling.

Multiple nationwide safety sources say concern has escalated since Atomwaffen posted a video on-line, exhibiting the group in possession of a lot of firearms and bulletproof vests, whereas selling hate.

While that is all horrifying and regarding, there may be some good news in the midst of it, and that’s that the RCMP, and Canada’s spy company, CSIS, are exhibiting a major stage of cooperation, and that wasn’t at all times the case traditionally. The nation actually wants it.

That’s our present for at the moment. We’ll see you once more subsequent week.